posted
The debates will also have a lot to do with the outcome of the election.
-------------------- Elz is my favorite model, but it's a close race! Sasha, Candi, and Nikki come very close! Posts: 652 | Registered: Aug 2004
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posted
I strongly disagree that neither Bush nor Kerry address any relevant issues most people are facing. But I DEFINITELY think that the FOCUS of the media has been almost entirely on the horse race and not the issues. So I understand the cynicism.
Both Kerry and Bush have plans (and vastly diverging plans at that) for health care reform, tax reform, education reform, environmental and energy policy, they have a fundamentally different approach and view of foreign policy, and lots more.
What really burns me up is that far too many people are staunchly partisan, so they only hear of the opposing party's views from their own party's campaign - and they ALWAYS wildly distort their opponent's views. Thus, most people are MISinformed by partisans, and simply UNinformed by the media.
Typical political discourse is this: one candidate's supporter mocking a false caricature of the opposing party's candidate, and then offering an equally false, unrealistic, sunny and polished view of their own candidate.
So yes - I REALLY understand the cynicism! Posts: 62 | Registered: Nov 2003
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quote: Both Kerry and Bush have plans (and vastly diverging plans at that) for health care reform, tax reform, education reform, environmental and energy policy, they have a fundamentally different approach and view of foreign policy, and lots more.
You just made my point..( I KNOW THIS)
Then stop comparing dick size and let the people here the plans!!!!
TALK TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm educated...I could care less how big these guys dicks are!!!!!!
I realize the conventions are nothing more than political pep rallies....BUT SAY SOMETHING RELEVANT!!!! DEMS OR REPUBS
I'm looking forward to the debates..I HOPE THESE GUYS DEBATE!!!NO ROLLING OVER
quote: So yes - I REALLY understand the cynicism!
I'm not being CYNICAL.I'm being a realist....
quote: Typical political discourse is this: one candidate's supporter mocking a false caricature of the opposing party's candidate, and then offering an equally false, unrealistic, sunny and polished view of their own candidate.
Then learn from history! Bill Clinton and Ronald Regan ran two of the most successful first term campaigns ever..Why?.They were dreamers...They knew how to speak to the people..Convey their dreams..Wheather you liked these guys or not....The formula worked!!! There were smears (always are) BUT..... WHEN THEY SPOKE .THE MAIN FOCUS WAS ON OUR COUNTRY AND THE DREAMS THEY HAD.(FOR THIS COUNTRY).They made us feel good about who they were.. I realize the world has changed since Clinton and Bush ran for office.BUT..... KERRY AND BUSH DONT MAKE ME FEEL GOOD ABOUT WHO THEY ARE (RIGHT NOW)....MAYBE MY MIND WILL CHANGE...THERE ARE TWO MONTHS LEFT????
I hope people feel the need to vote this time..No more hanging chads ..PLEASE!!!! LETS REALLY ELECT A PRESIDENT!
Whewwwwwwwwww.....time to get a BIG glass of wine and chill...... Foot models BLA BLA BLA
-------------------- Xoxoxo Sasha
essenceofsasha.com
You wanna play with my warm hosed feet. Don't you? Posts: 2077 | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
I think both Bush and Kerry themselves DO primarily talk about the relevant issues (but yes, they too sometimes indulge in the "dick size comparison" B.S.). It's the network pundits and DNC and RNC and campaign surrogates who engage in all the smearing, useless horse race crap, and "dick size comparison".
Personally, I've never once bought into the whole "president who shares his dreams" nonsense. I think you're right that it wins most people over when they do it well, but I MUCH prefer when candidates talk about facts and policy specifics rather than vague, poetical rhetoric.
Posts: 62 | Registered: Nov 2003
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quote: Personally, I've never once bought into the whole "president who shares his dreams" nonsense. I think you're right that it wins most people over when they do it well, but I MUCH prefer when candidates talk about facts and policy specifics rather than vague, poetical rhetoric.
Amen....my sentament too..But there is something to be said about a visonary..It makes people feel comfortable...less divided and uncertain.
Its MARKETING 101......Clinton and Regans people were masters of this......;-))
-------------------- Xoxoxo Sasha
essenceofsasha.com
You wanna play with my warm hosed feet. Don't you? Posts: 2077 | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
I have this bad habit of always seeming to see the world differently...
Subtle and not so subtle clues lead me to believe that slowly...ever so slowly...the people are taking the measure of each candidate...
Die hard partisans aside...their votes are fixed and cannot be swayed...
The "silent" majority...
Those who can be swayed...
Are beginning...to find....that Mr Kerry may not be the right man for the job at this time...
Pre 9/11...Mr Kerry would have been a better candidate for the Dems to run...
Post 9/11...Mr Kerry is a bad fit...
I mean no disrespect to the Democratic party when I say that:
They need to recognize that post 9/11 is different...
They need to listen to Zell Millar...
Americans are worried and concerned...
They turn on their TV's and they watch in horror as 150 children are slaughtered in Russia...
Or 89 people loss their lives as Suicide Bombers detonate the bombs they have strapped to their bodies while on an airplane...(women bombers...)
This is World War IV...
I strongly disagree that the debates will affect this election...
This election is already decided...
I predict that come Nov 3rd, John Kerry will not have been elected the 44th President of these United States...
Now...if anyone doubts this...
All you have to do...is watch the way he behaved and spoke during his "screed" in Ohio as the clock struck midnight last Friday after the Presidents speech Thursday night...
He went off the rails...almost the way Mr Dean did...
I believe in my heart that even John Kerry knows that it is over and that from now and until Nov 2nd is compelled to go through the motions...
Will the last one out...please turn out the lights?
This party is over!
Posts: 299 | Registered: May 2004
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quote: I MUCH prefer when candidates talk about facts and policy specifics rather than vague, poetical rhetoric.
How long you been waiting on this? I have to say I have been waiting on this for a really long time. I have to wonder at what point in this countries history did it become like this. When canidates dont win because thier worthy of the job they win because they make us think thier not as bad as the other guy. That would be like me appointing one man foreman over another because I didnt think he would screw up as bad as the other. Not that I didnt think the first man would screw up but maybe just not as bad. Where did our choices go? Are these two men the best we can do? Of over the 300 million people in this country these two men are the best we could come up with to govern us? I say NO! No way this great nation has to settle for these two lieing, power hungry, elitist (a group of persons who by virtue of position or education exercise much power or influence)
We can all pray that one day the american voter will open thier eyes and say " What? No thank you."
Long live WU!
-------------------- To get what you want. STOP doing what isn't working. Posts: 1514 | Registered: Aug 2004
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posted
"Our situation a this point in time is very serious...And is John Kerry the man to lead our NATION at this time????"
I agree that these are particularly "serious times", but I think that Bush is the one who has demonstrated the past four years that he's simply not up to the task.
Just after 9-11, I thought he was doing a magnificent job fighting terrorism. He brought both Americans and the world together in a common purpose in rooting out terrorism. I remember being weary of the military decision in Afghanistan to let the Northern Alliance do most of the fighting - I thought that we should throw everything we had at the Taliban and Al Qaeda and made sure the job was done right. Overall though, I thought Bush was doing a good job.
Then the whole Tora Bora debacle happened, and that was the beginning of the end of my support of Bush. We had Osama cornered in a cave, and the decision was made to have American forces merely play a supporting role to the Northern Alliance in caputring Osama. As we all know, he got away.
It was at that time that I became far less confident in Bush's decision-making.
Nevertheless, at that time, we had tremendous support from our European and Arab allies. The French and Germans made significant arrests and played a strong role in freezing the assets of terrorists. Remnants of Al Qaeda and the Taliban were being captured and killed in Afghanistan. Things were looking promising.
But then came Bush's decision to bring Iraq into the spotlight.
The systematic and deadly stream of incompetence with which Bush has carried out the whole Iraq mess has shocked me. From beginning to end, he's screwed up almost every step of the way: the senseless and arrogant diplomatic posturing with the U.N. in the lead up to the war; declaring false and exaggerated claims of Iraq's WMD; spreading the idea of a Saddam connection to 9-11; ignoring and subverting those who asked the hard questions about how the occupation should be handled, and providing a silly and totally unrealistic view of what that occupation would be like; blithely accepting bogus intelligence reports from dubious sources; awarding no-bid contracts to Dick Cheney's company Halliburton; publicly declaring to capture or kill Al Sadr and then not following through; and much, much more.
Then, Bush made it clear that he was firmly against the creation of the 9-11 Commission, saying that it would distract them from carrying out the war on terror. Right. Under unrelenting pressure from the families of the 9-11 victims, the commission was finally formed. Thomas Kean, the Republican chairman of the commission, reported that the Bush administration was being uncooperative to the point of actually being disruptive.
It was at that point that I became DISGUSTED with Bush.
I could go on and on citing specific instances of Bush's incompetence, disingenuousness, vindictiveness, and ineffectiveness, but I think you get the idea - Bush has done such a poor job the last four years that I firmly believe he needs to be replaced.
Posts: 62 | Registered: Nov 2003
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quote: Bush has done such a poor job the last four years that I firmly believe he needs to be replaced
Is Kerry better? Should we replace Bush with someone who could be worse? If your not straight up and down repub or dem this election holds nothing for you. The ONLY reason to vote for either one is to tow a party line so you can say your side won. Like I have said before I am just baffled this is the best we could come up with.
Long live Wu!
-------------------- To get what you want. STOP doing what isn't working. Posts: 1514 | Registered: Aug 2004
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posted
Lord, in my previous post I listed several specific incidents that have led me to conclude that, "Bush has done such a poor job the last four years that I firmly believe he needs to be replaced," to which you replied, "Is Kerry better?" The answer to that is yes, Kerry is better, because he's not the one who did the things I mentioned, Bush is. My speculation is that Kerry would have pursued the Taliban and Al Qaeda in Afghanistan with more focus and power than Bush did, and not have led us into the distraction of Iraq. And hypothetically, if Kerry would have decided that we did have to invade Iraq, he would not have ignored and subverted those who demanded an accounting of what the plan would be for the occupation or had uncomfortable projections of what the post-invasion conditions would be like. I don't think Kerry would have carried out diplomacy with the U.N. with the same kind of senseless arrogance that had the effect of alienating us from many allies like Bush did. Unlike Bush, Kerry would not have surrounded himself with neoconservative idealogues who were determined to invade Iraq on reasons that had nothing to do with 9-11, but didn't hesitate to cite 9-11 as the motivation for the invasion. I also don't believe that Kerry would have fought and defied the 9-11 Commission the same way that Bush did. I also believe that Kerry would never have cut funding to firefighters, police, and other first responders after 9-11 like Bush did, and he would have done more to beef up our security right here in U.S. in ways that Bush has failed to do. In mistake after mistake after mistake that Bush has made, I think Kerry would have either avoided it altogether, or handled it far better.
You then go on to ask, "Should we replace Bush with someone who could be worse?"
The problem with this question is that the logic behind it is equally valid if we consider Bush running against Adolf Hitler or John McCain. ANYONE, logically, COULD be a worse president than Bush, and that's why I think that question is not useful. I prefer to ask, "Has Bush's performance the last four years as president warranted him a second term? If not, do the qualities of the challenger make it reasonable to speculate that he would be a better replacement?"
My assessment is that Kerry would make a far better president than Bush in these "serious times".
Posts: 62 | Registered: Nov 2003
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posted
Everything that was stated above is why GW will win...... The Republicans are doing such a good job makeing Kerry have to defend himself, that the focus is off the important things... Republicans are the marketing CHAMPS right now!!!! Dont even argue that point...
Furthermore......
The Democratic party knowing all the above...ELECT KERRY to be the DEMOCRATIC front runner??????
This is the best they could do!!
The Democratic party is in complete kaos... The guy representing the PARTY isnt even the the GUY they wanted!!
WAY TO FAR TO LEFT!! That scares the hell outta people.. They need to centralize themselves more. Kerry's not the guy whos gonna do this.....
Reality is Reality.....Democrates are in fact settleing for second best...Horrible MARKETING by THE democratic party.HORRIBLE!!!!
Forgive my butchering of the ENGLISH language.I'm at work and in a RUSH...
I love this thread....All great points for debate!!!!!!
-------------------- Xoxoxo Sasha
essenceofsasha.com
You wanna play with my warm hosed feet. Don't you? Posts: 2077 | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
I try to stay out of political threads because I have some pretty strong opinions and hate to argue over this stuff. However, I am bored today and feel like making one statement.
The number one priority for me is the safety of my family and this country.
Bush means what he say's about terrorism and has the middle east scared of what he might do next. I PERSONALLY love that!
Nobody, and I mean NOBODY is afraid of Kerry and Edward's. I shutter to think of what their response would be to another attack on our country.
No need to condemn or argue my viewpoint with me. It won't change regardless of any "issues", "findings", "commission reports" or "facts" anyone posts.
I am looking forward to the debate(s) though. I think that will be very interesting.
I love to see Sasha posting and wish some of the other girl's around here would get involved in the sports and political posts!
-------------------- DJ Posts: 4159 | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
hey DJ......yea I've always been a big mouth when it comes to politics......I like it in a sick kinda way...
I think issues around the world and home are so frigin important
As for sports.ROCK ON ...I love not knowing whats going to happen..Sports is real reality TV....
Photo guy is less nuts...he owns his own buisness....He says FUCK the DEMS and their raising my taxs!!!!! I PROVIDE JOBS!!!!!!ITS CAPITALISM! NOT SOCIALISM...
Thats where he stands....he feels the most important thing on Sept 8 2004....IS THE SAFTY OF OUR COUNTRY!!!
I DO TO.......but I like to look at the whole picture......Thats just me....I don't see things so black and white
-------------------- Xoxoxo Sasha
essenceofsasha.com
You wanna play with my warm hosed feet. Don't you? Posts: 2077 | Registered: Apr 2004
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