-Hal-
Posted by Maverick Matrix (Member # 2989) on :
Did she have to hide in a trash compactor? I didn't hear about that on the news interesting enough and Lansing isn't very far from me.
Posted by FootLongSub Zero (Member # 19380) on :
I guess when you're in that desperate hype zone, most of your focus goes towards your goal (gettin' away), then anything else.... This is how alotta bad guys (and gals) get caught. Very unfortunate for her.....
All I can say is that it was a very STUPID STUPID move.... wouldn't be suprized if she was an addict stealing for funding her next fix which I wouldn't agree with, but understandable. If she wasn't an addict and she survived, she would'of deserved a kick in the nuts if she had some Posted by LeDaemon (Member # 198) on :
I guess she had a "pressing" engagement! Har har har... I read that article on Rotten earlier today.
Posted by Ben Del Amitri (Member # 2724) on :
She was "hard pressed" to find an escape. I wonder if anybody realizes how much clothing and merchandise you'd have to steal from a TJ Maxx to get up to $500. That's a LOT of merch! And if you must die hiding out in a trash compactor, why do it at a Goodwill? That's adding insult to injury in a very ironic way.
[ August 22, 2008, 01:16 PM: Message edited by: Ben Del Amitri ]
Posted by -cfg- (Member # 13863) on :
That's a sad story. You have to wonder what was going on in her life that made her feel the need to commit that crime. She did a lot of stupid things that day, but no one deserves to die in a trash compactor.
Posted by LeDaemon (Member # 198) on :
quote:Originally posted by -cfg-: That's a sad story. You have to wonder what was going on in her life that made her feel the need to commit that crime. She did a lot of stupid things that day, but no one deserves to die in a trash compactor.
I'm cold blooded I guess because I really don't feel sorry for her at all. On top of the theft she even assaulted a security guy spraying him in the face with mace. If they were strapped for cash to pay for clothes she should've walked into the Goodwill store to do shopping rather than use their trash compactor as a hide out.
Posted by Ben Del Amitri (Member # 2724) on :
quote:Originally posted by LeDaemon:
quote:Originally posted by -cfg-: That's a sad story. You have to wonder what was going on in her life that made her feel the need to commit that crime. She did a lot of stupid things that day, but no one deserves to die in a trash compactor.
I'm cold blooded I guess because I really don't feel sorry for her at all. On top of the theft she even assaulted a security guy spraying him in the face with mace. If they were strapped for cash to pay for clothes she should've walked into the Goodwill store to do shopping rather than use their trash compactor as a hide out.
I'm with you a hundred percent on this. You make a good point on the mace / pepper spray. Particularly inasmuch as the "security" guy was probably some poor schmuck (in an ill-fitting uniform), making about six or eight dollars an hour ... and trying to do his JOB.
I also agree that if they were strapped for cash, they should have gone to Goodwill in the first place ... or, GET A JOB and consider the novelty of paying for their merchandise - rather than stealing it.
Not only is the pepper spray / mace a foul act to commit on top of the theft, it also demonstrates clearly that it was an organized, pre-meditated larceny, rather than a compassionate act of survival, as some will no doubt try to portray this.
It probably won't be long before we see this story start popping up on the Darwin Awards, and similar sites; right alongside the guy who tried to rob a slaughter house filled with huge, burly, cleaver-wielding employees ... with a pocket knife.
Posted by footjoyboy (Member # 26478) on :
Instant Karma Crunch.....
_fjb_ Posted by -cfg- (Member # 13863) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ben Del Amitri:
quote:Originally posted by LeDaemon:
quote:Originally posted by -cfg-: That's a sad story. You have to wonder what was going on in her life that made her feel the need to commit that crime. She did a lot of stupid things that day, but no one deserves to die in a trash compactor.
I'm cold blooded I guess because I really don't feel sorry for her at all. On top of the theft she even assaulted a security guy spraying him in the face with mace. If they were strapped for cash to pay for clothes she should've walked into the Goodwill store to do shopping rather than use their trash compactor as a hide out.
I'm with you a hundred percent on this. You make a good point on the mace / pepper spray. Particularly inasmuch as the "security" guy was probably some poor schmuck (in an ill-fitting uniform), making about six or eight dollars an hour ... and trying to do his JOB.
I also agree that if they were strapped for cash, they should have gone to Goodwill in the first place ... or, GET A JOB and consider the novelty of paying for their merchandise - rather than stealing it.
Not only is the pepper spray / mace a foul act to commit on top of the theft, it also demonstrates clearly that it was an organized, pre-meditated larceny, rather than a compassionate act of survival, as some will no doubt try to portray this.
It probably won't be long before we see this story start popping up on the Darwin Awards, and similar sites; right alongside the guy who tried to rob a slaughter house filled with huge, burly, cleaver-wielding employees ... with a pocket knife.
I think my point is that all she did is steal some stuff and pepper spray a guard. No this is not right, but getting crushed in a trash compactor is a worse death than most convicted murderers get.
Posted by LeDaemon (Member # 198) on :
quote:Originally posted by -cfg-: I think my point is that all she did is steal some stuff and pepper spray a guard. No this is not right, but getting crushed in a trash compactor is a worse death than most convicted murderers get.
I must agree. However, she sentenced herself to her fate. The courts didn't get to prosecute her and the state didn't carry out her execution! If she was arrested and taken to jail I'm guessing she may have had a light sentence for shoplifting. Maybe even probation.
Posted by -cfg- (Member # 13863) on :
We always agreed on everything LD, just looking at the situation from different angles I guess. Posted by Elvzz (Member # 14178) on :
quote:Originally posted by -cfg-: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Ben Del Amitri: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by LeDaemon: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by -cfg-: [qb] That's a sad story. You have to wonder what was going on in her life that made her feel the need to commit that crime. no one deserves to die in a trash compactor.
Hard to judge why she did it, desperate times mean desperate measures. She obviously had no where to turn. Hasn't anyone felt alone? Shouldn't speak ill of the dead.
[ August 21, 2008, 10:00 PM: Message edited by: Elvzz ]
Posted by LeDaemon (Member # 198) on :
quote:Originally posted by Elvzz: Hard to judge why she did it, desperate times mean desperate measures. She obviously had no where to turn. Hasn't anyone felt alone? Shouldn't speak ill of the dead.
I dunno. For example I feel more for the people that work the honest jobs with the long hours for low pay that shouldn't have to worry about some guy that pops into their convenience store with a gun demanding all the money in the register then pumping a few bullets in the clerks head. Stealing $500 worth of clothes and bringing mace to spray in people's faces is not the same as sneaking a loaf of bread in your coat to feed hungry kids.
Perhaps I'm just biased because I've worked in restaurants and retail and have had places I've worked at involved with armed robberies. I was fortunate not to be working when those happened. The perps have no concern for anyone except for themselves and don't care if their actions are hurting other individuals.
As a kid I worked at a fast food restaurant that was robbed one night. The guy stepped through the drive through window and took the entire staff into the office and made them lay on the floor. He had the manager empty the safe of all the cash as well as all the payroll checks that had just been delivered earlier in the day. Luckily the guy didn't get trigger happy. The unfortunate thing was there wasn't a trash compactor out back for him to hide in when they called the cops when he left. Everyone was shaken after that and then the entire staff at the store went without pay for an extra week as the checks all had to be canceled and then reissued.
Posted by Elvzz (Member # 14178) on :
There once was a Pharroh who did not know.
I see your point.
Posted by Keyfeet (Member # 27313) on :
well theres a story to tell your kids about not stealing.
Posted by footjoyboy (Member # 26478) on :
Instant Karma Crunch.....
_fjb_ Posted by FootLongSub Zero (Member # 19380) on :
quote:Originally posted by footjoyboy: Instant Karma Crunch.....
_fjb_
... hehe, she must of been saving up alot of petty crimes to recieve that one ------------------------------------------- I've been thinkin' about if I was her. I would of jumped in there where no one would look or bother to check... (If someone was running away from me and jumped into a trash compactor, I wouldn't think that someone would be stupid enough to hop in there.....)so this may of been a smart move on her part.
She probably had enough room in there to feel comfortable for a while. Someone started the compactor, she probably thought it would be ok because of the room she had. Debris started to close in around her but she thought it would be still ok as the human body can stand quite a bit of pressure. She started to get worried as it started to hurt but panicing she was probably saying to herself "OH SHIT..... OH SHIT...." (as you do). Until somthing snapped either a rib, arm, leg whatever the case may be, and screamed.... still closing in, the reaction time for the compactor operator to assess the situation before stopping with more bones snapping, guts mashing.... those few crucial milliseconds would of been a matter of life and death.....
All I can say is when it's your time.... it's your time. Posted by Ben Del Amitri (Member # 2724) on :
quote:Originally posted by Elvzz:
quote:Originally posted by -cfg-: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Ben Del Amitri: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by LeDaemon: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by -cfg-: [qb] That's a sad story. You have to wonder what was going on in her life that made her feel the need to commit that crime. no one deserves to die in a trash compactor.
Hard to judge why she did it, desperate times mean desperate measures. She obviously had no where to turn. Hasn't anyone felt alone? Shouldn't speak ill of the dead.
I've read and re-read several versions of this story and am not able to see or understand what part makes it "obvious" that she had nowhere to turn or was desperate. Desparate times? How desperate can you be when you can afford MACE? I am also unable to understand how feeling alone can be equivocated to committing criminal acts. Everybody in the world has felt alone at one time or another; I myself have felt horribly alone but that feeling never made me decide to go buy (or steal) some mace, enlist the help of an accomplish then go assault an innocent security guard in the routine performance of his duties and rob a TJ Maxx. Maybe I'm just not reading the story right, because I'm missing all these points.
[ August 22, 2008, 01:36 PM: Message edited by: Ben Del Amitri ]
Posted by J.J. (Member # 24686) on :
I find that except Elvzz everybody here is so ready to judge harshly that I'm very glad not to be in the position of that girl. It has to be a very nice feeling to be able to judge so clearly over others, to have 'right' and 'wrong' so clearly defined, respect! (lifts hat).
Each and every one of us will brake the law if circumstances call for it, wether we agree with it or not, wether we are 'good' citizens or not. The fact that many of you haven't been in that position yet doesn't mean to say you're any better, it just means to say you haven't been in that position yet.
I agree, don't speak ill of the dead.
Posted by HailyWood (Member # 25294) on :
The really sick part is going to come when the dead woman's family tries to sue Goodwill for leaving the trash compactor open and unlocked to passers-by.
Posted by Malory (Member # 9101) on :
quote:Originally posted by J.J.: I find that except Elvzz everybody here is so ready to judge harshly that I'm very glad not to be in the position of that girl. It has to be a very nice feeling to be able to judge so clearly over others, to have 'right' and 'wrong' so clearly defined, respect! (lifts hat).
Each and every one of us will brake the law if circumstances call for it, wether we agree with it or not, wether we are 'good' citizens or not. The fact that many of you haven't been in that position yet doesn't mean to say you're any better, it just means to say you haven't been in that position yet.
I agree, don't speak ill of the dead.
I think right and wrong ARE clearly defined if you have a sense of values or morals. Fuzzy if you don't. I also dont think anybodys judging anything. A girl assults & steals, gets killed trying to escape. Those are facts & repeating them isnt judging. Cant speak ill of the dead, whos judging now? Guess you havent been to a history class then cause they say terrible things about Hitler, PolPot & lots of other dead people. Just my 2 cents.
Posted by footjoyboy (Member # 26478) on :
"I think right and wrong ARE clearly defined if you have a sense of values or morals. Fuzzy if you don't. I also dont think anybodys judging anything. A girl assults & steals, gets killed trying to escape. Those are facts & repeating them isnt judging. Cant speak ill of the dead, whos judging now? Guess you havent been to a history class then cause they say terrible things about Hitler, PolPot & lots of other dead people. Just my 2 cents." Comment by Malory
Yep.
_fjb_
Posted by Toetapper (Member # 6473) on :
If I have followed this thread correctly, I fall back on that dreaded notion of PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY.
Everybody makes dumb decisions and makes bad choices. They own-up to them and carry on.
Others will make choices KNOWING that they are the wrong/illegal/immoral/stupid ones. These folks expend a lot of effort trying to "get-away" with these choices and will go to extremes to hide their dishonesty...right down to burying themselves in filth to cover their misdeeds.
I regret that she died but she worked so hard toward this end, who am I to refuse her stupidity?
Do I seem unsympathetic? Well, I am.
Posted by J.J. (Member # 24686) on :
Umm, malory, did you just say that if I defended this girl I might as well defend hitler and co? (2 cents indeed).
The only place where right and wrong are clearly defined is in fairytales and hollywood movies.
Does this mean that I think you can't do wrong? No it doesn't because, like you, I try to do what I think is good.
Posted by Ben Del Amitri (Member # 2724) on :
quote:Originally posted by J.J.: Umm, malory, did you just say that if I defended this girl I might as well defend hitler and co? (2 cents indeed).
The only place where right and wrong are clearly defined is in fairytales and hollywood movies.
Does this mean that I think you can't do wrong? No it doesn't because, like you, I try to do what I think is good.
I can't speak for Malory, but you obviously didn't actually read what she said. In mentioning Hitler (and Pol Pot), she is doing so in reference to "speaking ill of the dead", which you have seen fit to decry as something "wrong" ... which, ironically is not something others are allowed to cite in the case of bald criminality, in your view.
As to your miopic view of right and wrong only being defined in fairytales and movies ... that speaks clearly of your own character (or lack thereof); and demonstrates you to be the perfect person to defend criminitality in general - and this criminal, specifically.
Ironically, this belief of yours flies in the face of your simple dictim that it is wrong to "speak ill of the dead". If there is no such thing as right and wrong, then how can it be wrong to "speak ill of the dead"? And how is this worse then the criminal act you are so quick to defend? These questions are rhetorical, and are intended to illustrate a view.
[ August 24, 2008, 03:13 PM: Message edited by: Ben Del Amitri ]
Posted by J.J. (Member # 24686) on :
(Sighs, takes hat totally off this time and scratches his head, sighs again.)
Don't worry too much about it Ben, people who suffer from narrow-mindedness often call people with a somewhat broader outlook on life "myopic", "character-less" or even "criminal". It doesn't really make you stupid, just ignorant.
You obviously didn't read all of what's been said otherwise you might have noticed that it wasn't me that said "don't speak ill of the dead", it was Elvzz and I seconded him because I agree with him. Nor did I say it is wrong to speak of ill of the dead, I (he) just asked people not to.
Funny, people falling all over me like that, I must have hit a sore spot.
I think it's plain ugly the way some of you speak about this poor girl and if that makes me all of what you said it makes me then so be it.
Posted by Ben Del Amitri (Member # 2724) on :
quote:Originally posted by J.J.: (Sighs, takes hat totally off this time and scratches his head, sighs again.)
Don't worry too much about it Ben, people who suffer from narrow-mindedness often call people with a somewhat broader outlook on life "myopic", "character-less" or even "criminal". It doesn't really make you stupid, just ignorant.
You obviously didn't read all of what's been said otherwise you might have noticed that it wasn't me that said "don't speak ill of the dead", it was Elvzz and I seconded him because I agree with him. Nor did I say it is wrong to speak of ill of the dead, I (he) just asked people not to.
Funny, people falling all over me like that, I must have hit a sore spot.
I think it's plain ugly the way some of you speak about this poor girl and if that makes me all of what you said it makes me then so be it.
This is just right. The poster's own words reflect himself more adeptly than any rebuttal I could possibly craft. I rest my case.
[ August 24, 2008, 07:49 PM: Message edited by: Ben Del Amitri ]
Posted by LeDaemon (Member # 198) on :
Guys, I love to debate on these types of threads. However, lets not jump into saying hurtful things towards the other members on Wu's. Mkay?
Posted by Ben Del Amitri (Member # 2724) on :
As I mentioned ... the poster's words render any type of rebuttal as unnecessary. Definitely agree.
Posted by Keyfeet (Member # 27313) on :
people, if she never have stolen; she wouldn't have to hide; therefore she would not have gone into the trash compactor; therefore she would not have been killed like that.
moral of the story, don't steal
Posted by FootLongSub Zero (Member # 19380) on :
quote:Originally posted by Keyfeet: moral of the story, don't steal
... from there Posted by DennisIsEvil (Member # 11755) on :
quote:Originally posted by Keyfeet: people, if she never have stolen; she wouldn't have to hide; therefore she would not have gone into the trash compactor; therefore she would not have been killed like that.
moral of the story, don't steal
She also decided to commit which was basically assault and battery. How dare that security guard actually do his job and interfere with her commiting larceny. In the end I have no sympathy for her.
Posted by Toetapper (Member # 6473) on :
Another thought in this matter comes to mind:
I have had the misfortune to be in courtrooms from time to time where I've been able to observe and draw a conclusion; additionally, I have a young friend who now works in a Prosecutor's Office as a lawyer who strongly agrees with me based on his experience:
CRIMINALS ARE NOT SMART PEOPLE.
When was the last time you saw a Nobel Laureate dragged off to the the Gray-Bar Hotel on "Cops"? On this program, I can usually tell who the "bad-guy"/"dumb-guy" is because he isn't wearing a shirt and he staggers. For the large part, these people are not prone to making good decisions. One bad choice tends to lead to another which breeds a whole series of them in turn.
A modestly bright person can see this self-perpetuating chain and stop it by simply acknowledging the first bad decision when it's made and accepting the consequences (which are usually more inconvenient than punishment).
Surely some have heard of the Darwin Awards. These are given to those people who remove themselves from the gene-pool so that their "dumbness" isn't passed on to future generations. This woman certainly merits consideration.
Posted by LeDaemon (Member # 198) on :
Just think of how differently it could've panned out if they handled the shoplifter with a little more TLC like they did in this video! http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/900670/ Posted by FootLongSub Zero (Member # 19380) on :
^^ That was some funny shit... Her trying hard to avoid attention....
She was walking away quite quickly, hope she didn't go towards the trash compacting area. Hey, for safety reasons, I say they need signs NOW above trash compactors saying "NO THIEVES ALLOWED" Posted by Toetapper (Member # 6473) on :
quote:Originally posted by FootLongSub Zero: Hey, for safety reasons, I say they need signs NOW above trash compactors saying "NO THIEVES ALLOWED"
That would be an open invitation...all the thieves would go there as their first choice.
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That was some funny shit... Her trying hard to avoid attention....