posted
This is advice to new and established foot video producers.
Recently, I had two almost back-to-back shoots with girls who had their boyfriends in tow. I said in tow because the girls were the drivers, not the other way around. One girl brought her boyfriend and her baby to her shoot [double whammy]. The other, brought her "cousin". I learned from the dude who got the ball rolling with me shooting her, that this "cousin" goes everywhere she does. So now, I'm figuring he is her boyfriend. I told the first girl if we were to shoot again, she couldn't bring her baby. I figured that would prompt the boyfriend to stay home and babysit. Nope. Dude still showed up with her sans baby. The other girl returned with her cousin.
Needless to say, both times, the boyfriend put the kibosh on the shoot just from being there. This isn't the first time I had boyfriends at shoots. Some girls can bring it no matter who is there, such as Taylor Fox, Slyyy, Carla, Chiqui, Alison, Mistress Kendra, and Lucy Die.
The thing is, if the girl is dominant in the relationship, she will deliver, even with her boyfriend there. If he is the dominant one, she will act like a deer in headlights; in her videos, her eyes will look over at him, and she will behave in an inhibited manner. Her lack of energy and enthusiasm will translate into the finished product. And if you provide her with images or video from the shoot that are less than stellar, she will blame you for any perceived poor quality and/or lack of direction, not the boyfriend and his presence. You will probably blame the boyfriend for being there, but the fact is, you should blame yourself for allowing him to be there.
Getting the best from a girl is not the only important thing when you ban the boyfriend; your safety is important. They may say they need to feel safe because they don't know you. Heck, you don't know them either!
A few years ago, a girl answered a flyer I posted. When she arrived, she came in a car with dark tint. Her tatted up boyfriend was the driver. He looked like a thin Chris Brown, seemed like he'd done jail time, and had the look of someone who would do anything for a meal. There was another dude in the car who said he would wait. Next thing I knew, he didn't want to wait, and got out of the car. He was dressed in a hoodie with the hood pulled up. It was broad, sunny daylight, and no rain whatsoever. So why the hood? He too looked like he would do anything for a meal. They were all cool, but after about 5 minutes, I had this feeling I had to get them out of there. So I lied, said I had to be somewhere soon, paid her, and as soon as they left, I left!
Long story short, its better to ban the boyfriend to get the best from the girl. Be ready to act as if you are walking away from a buy at a car dealership if the salesperson doesn't want to work with you. There are many girls out there who will do your shoots, so don't get hung up on any of them for the sake of getting them in front of your camera. She will respect you more for vetoing the boyfriend upfront, than for allowing him, and not wanting him there.
-------------------- You must do what you feel is right, of course-Obi Wan Kenobi Posts: 2662 | Registered: Jan 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote: The thing is, if the girl is dominant in the relationship, she will deliver, even with her boyfriend there. If he is the dominant one, she will act like a deer in headlights; in her videos, her eyes will look over at him, and she will behave in an inhibited manner. Her lack of energy and enthusiasm will translate into the finished product. And if you provide her with images or video from the shoot that are less than stellar, she will blame you for any perceived poor quality and/or lack of direction, not the boyfriend and his presence. You will probably blame the boyfriend for being there, but the fact is, you should blame yourself for allowing him to be there.
This is Truth, been there and still do that lol! Only a grassroots photographer who works in the public realm with real models knows this factor.
On the other topic of "banning" boyfriends, it's impossible to tell them to do so on a first shoot. But second time I work with them, no one comes because as you said they are way too much of a distraction for her. Escort the 1st shoot, but that is it because you've already met and established that relationship.
--------------------
Join thousands of our fans on Twitter @Norcalfeetdotco Posts: 18306 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
My feeling is, keep potential enemies as close to you as possible. Earn his trust and keep him close - this lets him feel that you value his role. He is a necessary evil. However, once he trusts you, you will get the freedom you need.
With one model, I met her and the bf first and bought them both drinks and cigarettes. I talked to the dude first, making him feel that he's in control. I showed him example shots, positions and how I'd shoot them. I complimented his gf constantly and explained how great she would be. He seemed to be comfortable that I was treating them both with respect.
He appreciated this and now he just drops her off and comes back to pick her up. I get the FJ/footworship shots I need, in private. I had to earn this after the first shoot, but this approach paid off. I have his #, and the girl's #. Whenever I need her, I txt him first.
That's just my approach, and it won't work with all guys -- but I think it will work with most of them, IF they were already open to the idea of their gf being a foot fetish model.
quote:Originally posted by KlassFX: My feeling is, keep potential enemies as close to you as possible. Earn his trust and keep him close - this lets him feel that you value his role. He is a necessary evil. However, once he trusts you, you will get the freedom you need.
With one model, I met her and the bf first and bought them both drinks and cigarettes. I talked to the dude first, making him feel that he's in control. I showed him example shots, positions and how I'd shoot them. I complimented his gf constantly and explained how great she would be. He seemed to be comfortable that I was treating them both with respect.
He appreciated this and now he just drops her off and comes back to pick her up. I get the FJ/footworship shots I need, in private. I had to earn this after the first shoot, but this approach paid off. I have his #, and the girl's #. Whenever I need her, I txt him first.
That's just my approach, and it won't work with all guys -- but I think it will work with most of them, IF they were already open to the idea of their gf being a foot fetish model.
agreed, it all depends on the vibe the guy puts out...most of the time it's not a problem but with thugs like Jedi described you don't ever want those kind coming to your shoot not only because of distraction but at any moment they may feel your content isn't what they want their girl doing and try to mug you, take your equipment, etc...unless you're smart on those outings and bring protection (not the condom kind either).
--------------------
Join thousands of our fans on Twitter @Norcalfeetdotco Posts: 18306 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
I have two pieces of advice that will greatly improve the operation of any amatuer/grassroots photographer who has run into these problems. These two strategies stem from years of my own experience in the field dealing with both foot models and their boyfriends/escorts. My tried and trued methods will help any person who does not want to deal with boyfriends being on set. God knows, I used to hate dealing with them myself and nowadays, the issues have been completely resolved for all sides and I don't have to take any risks... all while still getting the girl. My knowledge and techniques in this arena are pure Goldschläger!
1) First and foremost, the best way to avoid escorts or boyfriends at the shoot is to build enough comfort and rapport with the girl right off the bat to where she doesn't feel like she needs to bring someone along. This is long and drawn out to explain for every possible variation of encounter, but the process by which to get to that point is what is key.
Proof? --> Over the years, from experience, studying, and numerous encounters, I have learned how to dissolves fears and concerns that women might have about me as a person. It is not just random chance because I have simply done wayyyy too many foot shoots over time, and I have a large enough data sample set to see how the metrics support my analysis. I've been involved in feet shoots since 2001 and have done well into the hundreds. In my earlier days, I consistently had about 20% of my shoots consist of having an escort, boyfriend, or husband on set. Nowadays, less than 5% of my shoots consist of bringing a boyfriend or escort along.
This change in metrics is definitely not due to some consistently new/unexplainable reduction in chance and is 100% due to skills learned from the "seduction community" over the years. Since that quoted phrase is way beyond the scope of this post, just google it if you want to employ the benefits from my 1st method that I've shared.
2) Okay, for method number two. This is a middle-ground sort of method that addresses the models concerns about safety and addresses the photographer's concerns about distractions on set. If you combine this approach with method #1, you will rarely ever have to use this method #2 approach, so it is only applicable when the model says she wants to bring or just shows up with a surprise escort.
Prior to the shoot taking place, explain to both the model and her escort that they are both welcome to inspect the entire premises prior to the shoot. Let them know that her safety is also your biggest concern and that you invite them to check every nook and cranny of the house or apartment for weapons, people hiding in closets, or under beds or whatever. Allow them to fully inspect the premises until they are satisfied with the safety of the set.
Then when they both deem the place is safe, you stick to the rule that the escort must wait outside for the duration of the shoot. This is to prevent distractions on set. It is a very easy rule to sell to the couple if you explain it as procedure/policy aimed at the model's safety and efficiency of the shoot. If you ever need to justify reasons for shoot efficiency, just calculate the cost you are paying per minute and how much money is lost each time an escort is catered to during the shoot or a model looks away from the camera to smile at so-and-so, etc. etc.
If you explain your process in a detached, calm, and logical fashion, the boyfriend/escort will detect your professionalism and will view this no differently than her working as a cashier at McDonald's and why the fast food establishment might have a problem with friends hanging out inside her workplace all day. It's win-win for horny photographer and concerned model alike. Put it into practice boiz! This is where known amateurs can now take that giant leap for mankind LOL! Posts: 83 | Registered: May 2013
| IP: Logged |
quote: That's just my approach, and it won't work with all guys -- but I think it will work with most of them, IF they were already open to the idea of their gf being a foot fetish model.
It's not the Male Escorts that are the true issue necessarily, it's the girls and they have the right to bring an escort no matter what. I have seen a lot of comments from strangers over the years regarding strategies about this and that and illusions of grandeur about the modeling and photography industry but in fact the exact opposite is true in professional and personal encounter scenarios myself and all my professional colleagues can attest to.
Many of these "guys with a camera" trying to "hook up" with the models have ruined it for the honest hard working Pro-Photographer out there, hence women are a little leery at first chance encounters. For those I say , let the pros handle the real models and go create a Fetlife profile considering yourself a hobbyist looking to snap a few pics.
Luckily a lot of well established Pros like myself show models a professional portfolio with years of experience and the women are instantly turned on by our talents and are at ease around us. Add a little no -strings attached humor and flirts about their overall beauty and you will have a model or female in general eating out of your hand because they can sense your intentions immediately.
One can learn well from Myself, or other professional pioneers in the business like Space City Soles, FootsieTootsies.com (Those Toes) or Hal, or Patrick....they can all attest that no matter what, these girls who feel the need for safety even if they are coming to meet Santa Claus will bring escorts or boyfriends for comfort if they don't know you. Unless of course they refer to my 1st scenario of viewing an awesome portfolio and they WANT to work with you at all costs to further their own agenda and get more work down the line. Bottom line, escorts will come or may not but as a legit trained professional we must accept but verify the escort and lay ground rules once they are there.
--------------------
Join thousands of our fans on Twitter @Norcalfeetdotco Posts: 18306 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
^ Well there's no disagreement here in that you're working with professional models in a professional shooting environment. It took years to get this privilege, and now you can set ground rules. But that's top 1% of content producers - everyone else is trying to earn their way there.
The remaining 99% are farming the streets just for a chance to get a portfolio. For this demographic, the escort/bf can be an incredible obstacle, pretty much like how the OP described. It's these guys that need the most help with that bf problem.
Did you have a consistently good tactic in your street days? Would love to hear from any of you.
quote:Originally posted by KlassFX: ^ Well there's no disagreement here in that you're working with professional models in a professional shooting environment. It took years to get this privilege, and now you can set ground rules. But that's top 1% of content producers - everyone else is trying to earn their way there.
The remaining 99% are farming the streets just for a chance to get a portfolio. For this demographic, the escort/bf can be an incredible obstacle, pretty much like how the OP described. It's these guys that need the most help with that bf problem.
Did you have a consistently good tactic in your street days? Would love to hear from any of you.
Like I said, don't be fooled by hearsay on this boyfriend/escort topic my friend. When you're part of that 99% just getting started you must learn to be confident enough not to let another male's presence in the room or area bother you when you're acting out your fantasy photo shoot with his girlfriend.
That's why you read some dialog about guys making boyfriends/male escorts check under beds/in closets or wait outside in the car because they haven't built their repoire yet or they have a guilty conscience about what they are doing because they have some kind of ulterior motive during a photo shoot and don't want to get caught by another male acting out such motive because it can be damaging to one's ego.
Again, take it in stride and be open to new ideas and concepts. I had to take many for the team early on myself by letting boyfriends hover around behind me and seeing them mouthing words to the model in the reflection on the LCD screen of the camera or smoking cigarettes behind me...even had a bum walk out of the forest with a red balloon in his hand that he gave to the model and kept standing right behind her while I was trying to shoot. Had another thug looking Vato stop my shoot once and ask if I wanted to buy a bunch of used tools from his van because he needed drug money LOL...so don't feel bad about sucking it up around the guys girls bring to shoots because the end result will be WELL worth it!
--------------------
Join thousands of our fans on Twitter @Norcalfeetdotco Posts: 18306 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by KlassFX: Would love to hear from any of you.
There are some great stalwarts in the foot fetish pickup community and these are footographers who've proven their track records by showing pictures/videos of themselves getting women's feet in an intimate fashion that indulges their fetish. For example, Patrick from soles of silk, heck just look at his avatar! Then there is goodguyneighbor from CaliforniaBeachFeet -- he has posted public videos on multiple occasions demonstrating how he got female strangers to put their feet on his face with no boyfriend in tow. And of course there is Murray from EveryDayFeet, Doc from It-smells.com, and Josh from Feet N Soul, all true pioneers for professional foot fetishists.
These guys have taken foot fetish pickup to the next level and many times you don't hear anything about boyfriends showing up to their shoots because the models were naturally comfortable around them. Definitely beware of "guys with cameras" who might give advice under the pretense of being a professional. Often times, those unproven band-wagoneers are just average Joe's who don't understand their way around women, supported by the fact that they don't know (or visually demonstrate) how to escalate things to the next level. Their lack of credibility is easily spotted by how much real life proof they've shared of themselves actually getting feet.
These are the same kind of guys who believe it is impossible for men to be able to woo female strangers on 1st meetup. They are no different than the observing male wanderers at a bar who are standing in the corner, preaching to each other's choir about how females would never just get up and go home with some dude she just met... all-the-while, as this is going on right under their noses LOL!
There's alot of bad advice floating around out there on the internet, but my take is that it is best to use the advice from the seasoned professionals. Any amateur can just go out there and upload pictures to some online hiring profile in order to attract unsuspecting women through big offers of cash. But it's the distinguished foot photographers with the proven track records of being able to escalate activities on set who are the real deal when it comes to negating the effect of boyfriends or escorts. Those are the guys who have the real balls in this game, and as a result, they don't have to build rapport for months or years on-end before reaching a point where they can indulge their fetish.
There are many equitable similarities in the process of real-life dating. Some men understand how to move to the next level in record time, then there are those AFCs who simply don't get it. And in correlation, those AFCs are also the ones waiting for ages, while trying to figure out why their subjects won't budge, or why they can't bury their face in a girl's feet because her mother felt like she needed to consistently be there to protect her daughter. The proof is always in that pudding (known as their published track record), Heckeckeckeckeckeck
posted
I can understand girls wanting to bring a guy along in case the photographer gets "fresh" with her. So it's up to the photographer to insist that he's going to take photos of her and do nothing else.
-------------------- "You have very nice feet!" Posts: 3711 | Registered: Apr 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
True enough, escorts can be a distraction and buzz kill, but a few years ago I was doing a first time shoot with a cutie who brought along her large chunky aunt (I guess for protection and for transportation). I ended up shooting and smelling the aunts feet too, and all for the same price. ($ 45)
quote:Originally posted by aka.footjoyboy: True enough, escorts can be a distraction and buzz kill, but a few years ago I was doing a first time shoot with a cutie who brought along her large chunky aunt (I guess for protection and for transportation). I ended up shooting and smelling the aunts feet too, and all for the same price. ($ 45)
You mean the aunt's feet were as nice as the girl's? Cool!
-------------------- "You have very nice feet!" Posts: 3711 | Registered: Apr 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
This subject is intriguing to me. Because when I think of someone approaching my wife asking to take pictures of her feet, in my mind it's really no different than asking if they could photograph her breasts and I think I'd probably react similarly in each situation. But if someone asked to take shots of her hands it wouldn't bother me at all but maybe a guy with a hand fetish would lose his shit in that situation. Of course I'm in my 40's, my wife is in her mid-30's and we generally have our children with us out in public so, while my wife's feet are all the way luscious, I can't see us being approached when out and about. But I do have a question for all you photographers, what do you do in a situation where it becomes obvious that the significant other has a foot fetish and is none too pleased that his girl's been asked to model her feet. Do you sort of get a sixth sense and just avoid the situation when that vibe comes out? Do you ever have a dude just lose his shit and go psycho? As a side note, you guys are all really talented photographers. The feet in the pictures are great but more than that you all really seem to know what makes a good shot.
Posts: 138 | Registered: Sep 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by aka.footjoyboy: True enough, escorts can be a distraction and buzz kill, but a few years ago I was doing a first time shoot with a cutie who brought along her large chunky aunt (I guess for protection and for transportation). I ended up shooting and smelling the aunts feet too, and all for the same price. ($ 45)
Wow good price, I've heard of guys blowing wads of cash on skinny meth addicts with track marks on their arms with less joy than you probably got from that chubby aunt lol. How did her feet smell?
--------------------
Join thousands of our fans on Twitter @Norcalfeetdotco Posts: 18306 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
quote: But I do have a question for all you photographers, what do you do in a situation where it becomes obvious that the significant other has a foot fetish and is none too pleased that his girl's been asked to model her feet. Do you sort of get a sixth sense and just avoid the situation when that vibe comes out? Do you ever have a dude just lose his shit and go psycho?
Well Matt I will tell you, 100% of the boyfriends who admitted to having a foot fetish to me during a shoot actually were getting turned on by me photographing their girlfriends' feet. Maybe because it gave them jerk off material for later, I don't know.
No one has ever gone "Psycho" in public over feet around me (just the one remaining angry nerd hacker in cyberland basically) probably because they get intimidated by me at first glance, but they soon get a warm trusting vibe from me and they lose any thoughts of malcontent if they were headed that way. I take it back, there was one guy we kicked out of the old foot party venue up North because he didn't want to pay a model for a session that lasted nearly 2 hours and he only had $20 in his wallet He cried as we bounced him out, too much PTSD will warp your mind.
quote: As a side note, you guys are all really talented photographers. The feet in the pictures are great but more than that you all really seem to know what makes a good shot.
Thank You, being transparent, honest and talented shows in your work and public relations. I'm sure other professionals in the field will accept that honor as well.
--------------------
Join thousands of our fans on Twitter @Norcalfeetdotco Posts: 18306 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[Thumbs Up]](graemlins/thumbsup.gif)
![[Bow Down]](graemlins/bowdown2.gif)
![[Jerkoff]](graemlins/jerkoff.gif)
![[Cheers]](graemlins/cheers.gif)
![[Thud]](graemlins/thud.gif)
![[Bump]](graemlins/bump.gif)
![[Cool]](cool.gif)
![[Nut Kick]](graemlins/nutkick.gif)
He cried as we bounced him out, too much PTSD will warp your mind.
