posted
Cute link, may I improperly classify you as well? Great opinion from a site whos main statement is this: "This page is about me and why everything I like is great. If you disagree with anything you find on this page, you are wrong." Wow, sounds as logical as the racists you think I am like. This guy is more opinionated than me, but he doesnt even understand half the topics he talks shit about. BUT BOY IS HE FUNNY! Like an un-informed Dennis Leary. Too bad you do not see the point. Dont make me do something I dont want to, and I wont make you do something you dont want to. WHAT DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH RACE? I could be talking about smoking laws or seatbelts or anythings else. Ease up on the racial projection crap. By definition, just acknowledging that we have differences is a racist act. I guess I am as racist as everyone else on the planet by seeing the differences in us. Do you not understand the difference between racist and hateful? This is why the whole language thing is so important, if you and I have different definitions of the same word, we will have problems communicating.
posted
This link of his is even better! : http://maddox.xmission.com/c.cgi?u=irule Opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one, and they all stink. Thats why it is better to stick with the facts. this one didnt smell so bad: http://maddox.xmission.com/beat.html Thanks for the great new site! And the stimulating conversation.
posted
I figured it was only a matter of time before the racist accusations got thrown out there...
I don't know and don't care who the chicken-shit moron is who constructed and wrote up that page you linked to leopardskins (don't you just admire internet bad-asses and all their tough talk? ), but he's way off in any semblance of logic he pretends to have.
First off, the point about immigrants inherently working harder is absurd. By making such a blanketed statement like that, the idiot who made that page is just showing how uninformed he is. I have worked many different jobs, all blue-collar, and several of them along-side immigrants. I can tell you from personal observation that these "down-trodden yet so hard working" immigrants don't pull any more overtime, break their back, or go out on a limb any more than the whites and blacks that were already doing the job. What makes these immigrants so appealing in the eyes of an employer is not their performance! It's all about money. Should an employer pay an American born citizen $8.00 an hour if an immigrant will do the same job for $6.00? Oh yes, and here's why:
The Americans need the money more. I'm sure if I lived in a one-bedroom apartment with about twelve of my relatives, I too could easily live on $6.00 an hour. The fact of the matter is, I can't live on that amount of money, nor should I have to.
Why? Well, it's all about ethics, or morality you could say. Say for example's sake your parents are old and feeble, and you're given a certain alotment of money to take care of them. What will you do? Shack them up in some negligent retirement home where you don't know how well they'll be treated, or if they're suffering criminal neglect just so you can go out and spend the rest of the money on yourself? Or, will some morality kick in and you find yourself paying for a private nurse for at-home supervision, where you know for a fact your parents are taken care of and their needs are met?
By underscoring fellow American citizens and hiring in immigrants, all the employer is doing is looking out for his own best interests. He won't give a flying turd about how well the immigrants are doing the jobs as opposed to the citizens, it's about whether or not he'll be able to afford a new ivory back-scratcher or a new yacht once he see's the bottom-line in profits.
So Americans demand more money. Is this so wrong? When I worked at the Ann Taylor Distribution warehouse, I read a figure on how much the company CEO pocketed a year. Are you ready for this? $17 million A YEAR. Yet at the same time, this was the same company that "couldn't afford" a Christmas bonus to the employees, "couldn't afford" to give more than 30 cents a year for a raise to the employees, and also "couldn't afford" to keep everything in working order, thus preventing accidents (and believe you me, there were plenty of accidents because of bad equipment and conveyor lines).
Now, does it or does it not stand to reason that this CEO could still live like a king on $16 million a year, and reciprocate some of the money back to the employees that keep the company making money in the first place? Does this make these "lazy" Americans so vile and evil for wanting a nibble of the pie too? Nevermind a piece of the pie, just some crumbs to make them feel appreciated and let them know their work is noticed. This isn't the case though, and the employers are going even further and staffing with immigrants who are happy to get the $6.00 an hour instead of the $8.00. The same immigrants who won't make a fuss over low wages (their cost of living is drastically lower) and will send their dollars back across the border anyway.
I also find it interesting that the people who are so much in favor of immigrants taking jobs away from citizens are the ones who are least affected by it. I'll guarantee you that if half of these self-righteous loud-mouth's lost their cushy positions and fat paychecks, not to somebody who actually does the job better, but to somebody who will work for a lot less money, they'd change their tones real quick.
To imply that a person's problem with out-of-control immigration is racist is an arguement that is weak as water. It's a scape-goat explanation they throw out there because of the politically correct weight it carries, because they know most people would rather die before being thought racist in any way. It's a sad attempt at shutting people, who have every right to complain, up. It's also what what every minority group falls back on. But now, when you see these minorities raising the same kind of hell as the whites who have been ousted from jobs because of immigration, it makes the "racist card" more weak than it was to begin with.
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quote:Originally posted by Pink: Lou, did Neo get you started or did you get Neo started on this topic? I am never going to hear the end of this now. LOL! -Pink
I think it was sort of a mutual starting up Pink.
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quote:Originally posted by leopardskins: one thing that hasnt been mentioned here is the marketing and media. The Latino population is a growing population here, indeed. The people who wish to sell products to these people find it easier to try to sell them stuff in their native tongue, so they put Spanish on the menu/ Tyme Machine, whatever. Makes sense doesnt it , if that is your market? So then we blame the people, using their native tongue which is promoted back at them to sell them goods? You tell me. AS english speakers, would you not want to have things in english in another country? Would you be more inclined to buy a product if it was pitched in English?
No disrepect leopardskins, but it sounds like you're trying to avert the blame for a mass of people who aren't learning the language anyway.
To say their no-English speaking is a fall-back on the media and the advertisers sounds fairly reasonable, but it's not solid. For that matter, Pokemon is a Japanese phenomena from the foundation up, yet when they advertise it here in America for American kids, the ads, cards, games, toys, everything is in English. However, just because Bandai knows of an English speaking market, and caters to it accordingly, should they start making all their Japanese products of the same things in Japan bilingual? No. There are a lot of Americans in Japan, but Japanese is the native language. Like the saying goes: "When in Rome..."
All these advertisers are doing is exploiting what they think is an easy market. They're shooting for the quick buck, and that's about it. This is nothing new, hellfire, I can actually remember the Pilsbury Dough Boy rapping in a commercial one time! They were trying to "reach the African American market", but most blacks I know thought the commercial stupid and pointless, a slap in the face for anybody with intelligence.
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posted
If we had open borders we wouldn't be able to read stories like this:
Illegal Entry From Mexico to U.S. Rises
By OLGA R. RODRIGUEZ, Associated Press Writer
SASABE, Mexico - After a four-year decline, illegal immigration from Mexico is spiking as several thousand migrants a day rush across the border in hopes of getting work visas under a program President Bush (news - web sites) proposed. Many also are trying to beat tighter security to come in June.
The U.S. border patrol told The Associated Press that detentions — which it uses to judge illegal migration rates — jumped 25 percent to 535,000 in the six months ending March 31 compared to a year ago.
Near Sasabe, a town bordering the Arizona desert that's the busiest illegal border crossing area, an average 2,000 people arrive daily.
On a recent day, at a break in a barbed-wire fence outside Sasabe, about 300 migrants scrambled out of 10 trucks and four vans within 30 minutes with their smugglers, who led crowds along a worn trail. As the sun set, they disappeared into rolling hills that hide the treacherous desert.
Raudel Sanchez, a 22-year-old farm worker, said he wanted to get back to his job at a Minnesota ranch.
Sanchez crossed into the United States through Sasabe three years ago, but says the journey is getting more difficult. He walked three days in the desert and was out of water when he was caught in Arizona and deported.
Undeterred, he said he planned to take a bus to Altar, a northern city about 70 miles from the border where migrants hire smugglers. From there, he planned to head back to Sasabe and cross again.
"It's already very hard to cross, but it's going to be even harder," he said in Nogales. "I need to try again, at least one more time, and if I fail, I'll go back home."
Many migrants are betting on the approval of Bush's migration proposal, which faces an uphill battle in Congress. About 75 percent of those arrested are Mexican, while the rest are from Central America and other places, U.S. customs officials said.
In January, Bush proposed a guest-worker plan that would give legal status to undocumented migrants already working in the United States and to those outside the country who can prove they have been offered a job.
Because it's hard to get a job offer while in Mexico, many are heading north now, hoping to get settled before a program is in place.
Mexicans living in the United States have criticized Bush's proposal. Many say they wouldn't apply, fearing it could be a trap to deport them.
But in Mexico, the program has given many migrants hope that they might be able to seek something better north of the border, and that is enough to convince some to cross now rather than later.
"I want to try and make it to the United States to find out more about the permits because I've heard that with a job it will be easier to get" a visa, said Jaime Ulloa, speaking in Nogales after being deported for a third time. He is trying to get to Florida, where a U.S. farmer has promised him a job picking vegetables.
Mark Krikorian, executive director for the Center for Immigration Studies, a group that favors stricter immigration policies, said the rise in illegal migration also shot up in 1986 when an amnesty was announced.
"Illegal aliens will respond to the messages the government sends," Krikorian said. "When we send the message that we are thinking about amnesty, they decide it may be worth it to try to cross."
Illegal migration had been declining along the U.S.-Mexico border since 2000. U.S. border patrol figures show detentions dropped from 1.6 million in 2000 to 905,000 in the fiscal year that ended last Sept. 30.
There is no exact data on the number of people crossing illegally. But in an indication of increased traffic, 535,000 illegal migrants were arrested along the U.S.-Mexico border from Oct. 1 to March 31, said Gloria Chavez of the U.S. Customs and Border Protection Bureau.
In the same period, the border patrol's Tucson sector detained 70,000 more people, an increase of 49 percent.
U.S. Customs and Border Protection Commissioner Robert Bonner attributes part of the jump to increased security. "The main reason we're seeing an increase in apprehensions is because the border patrol is more effective, particularly in the Tucson sector," he said.
But Mexican officials are also seeing an increase. Grupo Beta, a Mexican government-sponsored group that tries to discourage migrants from crossing and aids those stranded in the desert, said 56,000 migrants went through Sasabe in March compared to 41,000 in March 2003.
In Altar, a farming town that has become the gathering point for those heading to Arizona, street vendors sell backpacks, water jugs and salt pills by the thousands.
The modest homes around the plaza, crowded with triple-decker bunk beds, serve as makeshift motels for migrants. They're almost always at capacity, said Francisco Garcia, a former mayor who now volunteers at the town's only migrant shelter.
"We're a town with a population of 6,000, and there have been weeks when we have twice as many people," Garcia said.
Under new security measures, about 300 more U.S. border agents will be deployed by June 1 along the Mexico-Arizona border. The number of border agents assigned to the Tucson sector will eventually increase from 1,800 to 2,500, Bonner said.
Many of the additional agents already have been sent to the Tohono O'odham Indian reservation, an area west of Sasabe where illegal migrant traffic has ballooned, said border patrol spokesman Charles Griffin.
The heightened border security is driving more migrants to more treacherous desert routes between Sonoyta and San Luis Rio Colorado in western Arizona, said Enrique Enriquez, an agent with Mexico's Grupo Beta.
Grupo Beta plans to assign rescuers to Sonoyta in May, Enriquez said. Every year, hundreds of migrants die in the desert, where temperatures soar above 100 degrees in summer.
posted
Ultimatly the cost of the crossings is in the millions a year in some states. Between the supporting both medically and education wise, it cost the states quite a bit of money as well as the taxpayers. Yes, everyone deserves a better life and each deserves an opportunity to do so, but at the same time when those that are already living in the state are paying the cost that the businesses should be paying, it becomes illogical. If the borders are kept open the government needs to do something to subsidize the states cost of the constant crossings. You have to ask, why are people coming here, and the main reason is to improve their lives. If the country that they were living in was improving, then they would not have to come here. If the US wants to resolve this issue either A. Pay the states and help subsidize the cost. B. Get with the leaders of the country that most of the immigartion is coming from and help make imporvements to that country to help the people. C. Make the country in which the immigration is coming from pay the cost which each state is incurring. or D. Close the borders until a better solution is figured out...
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), but he's way off in any semblance of logic he pretends to have.
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