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I meant his leftist ideas Lou, if all this people have to go back in a short period of time we will be bringing comunism back from the dead!!! That`s not taking into account AL QAEDA,I bet they are hoping to see 14 million people hungry and angry down there. We are the biggest investor in Latin America and Spain it`s the second,lots of targets to destroy,terrorists would have a lot to do for a long time. 20% of our oil comes from there,Iron,Copper,Bauxite,Uranium,Natural Gas,foodstuffs etc. Irak it`s the size of Texas and has a population of 25 million and we are having some problems there. Latin America has a population of 380 million and is 2 and a half times the size of the U S, invading it once the trouble starts would be suicide,specially now that we are at war and our fiscal deficit is at an all time high.
Posts: 66 | Registered: Jan 2005
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quote: Irak it`s the size of Texas and has a population of 25 million and we are having some problems there. Latin America has a population of 380 million and is 2 and a half times the size of the U S, invading it once the trouble starts would be suicide,specially now that we are at war and our fiscal deficit is at an all time high.
Good point...I think you answered your own question with this point, meaning there won't be any mass deportations, and especially not anytime soon.
I see where you're coming from in acknowledging Castro and his leftist agenda...but keep in mind that he wouldn't be where he is today without the American government helping put him there...I don't see him attacking America on his own accord, he strikes me as a dog on a leash that can bark really loud and that's about all...now if he had somebody within the US government give him the go-ahead to start some shit, that'd be a different story, but as for him capitalizing on a possible disharmony down the road, that disharmony involving a mass deportation, on his own, I personally don't see it. I could be wrong though...
It's interesting that you mention Iraq...as I read your response, and with mystik's response being fresh in my mind...I can't help but wonder why the government is so set on "liberating" a country half-way around the world when we've got a country in some seriously dire straits right on our land's border...I wonder how far HALF of the billions of dollars that have been spent on this Iraq war could've gone in helping Mexico. I mean, here are a group of people who would do anything, risk life and limb for a better shot at life, and our government is more preoccupied elsewhere...
That's where I'm saying looking the other way when it comes to illegal immigration is a quick fix, but not a long-range cure...what about the people who are too old or sickly to brave a trek across the desert, or get stuffed into a semi-tractor trailer for a ride across the border? What about them? All the while greedy capitalists are cashing in on this problem, American citizens are getting underbid for jobs, illegal immigrants are working as "legal slaves", and the other people back home are still in trouble with no prospect of hope...
Oh well, I'm rambling now. Sorry to hop up on the soap box.
-------------------- Like Girls? LikeReal Barefoot Girls?! Then this place is for you! www.dennis-n-mara.com Your best source for some Real Deal Hardcore Barefoot Girls! Posts: 5427 | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Lou Gojira: I can't help but wonder why the government is so set on "liberating" a country half-way around the world when we've got a country in some seriously dire straits right on our land's border...
Like many others have voiced before me in other forums of discussion, I say it's the oil. Which is probably the biggest underlying cause of our tensions with the middle east: They are fighting for land for religious reasons, the United States is fighting for it to ensure the survival of its own economy. If Mexico had the oil reserves that the Middle East had, the United States government would be pumping billions into its economy like one of those old lady chain-smokers at a Vegas slot machine. Same reason why no major action has been taken against Kim Jong Il and his public announcements of developing a nuclear program. How much oil is in North Korea? There you have it.
Anyways that's not the topic of this thread. I'm opposed to illegal immigration but not because of any perceived burden to society. I'm against it merely because it's unfair to people who take the trouble and time to go through the naturalization ceremony, to work through the proper channels, attend meetings, take tests, whatever it is that folks do when applying to become legal citizens. If you take two people of the same skill-set and education background, one a legal immigrant and one illegal, applying for the same job, what are the chances of Mr. Legal getting that job since the employer will have to pay him at least minimum wage? It's a question of employer ethics and as Lou has pointed out, too many employers are more than willing to cash in on the illegal labor force.
Arguably, it's also unfair to illegal immigrants. Alot of employers who exploit them have the attitude that "Bad jobs are better than no jobs at all." Until the government takes a hard-line stance in punishing such employers, it'll continue.
Posts: 228 | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Like many others have voiced before me in other forums of discussion, I say it's the oil.
Thank GOD you answered this like this...and not with..Bush wants to spread "FREEDOM and DEMOCRACY" throughout the middle EAST. We want to bring hope to a land that has none..WHAT A CROCK OF SHIT!!!!!!!
Oh yea.this post is about Mexico..Four more years of BULLSHIT!!!!! Oops there I go again....Sorry..
FREEDOM-FREEDOM-FREEDOM-FREEDOM-FREEDOM-FREEDOM Just preparing my exceptance speech for Mr Bush...
-------------------- Xoxoxo Sasha
essenceofsasha.com
You wanna play with my warm hosed feet. Don't you? Posts: 2077 | Registered: Apr 2004
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I am glad I started this little thread. I have a question for Tweener and probably for everybody else. Let`s take a second and imagine you are from a Latin American country,the economy of your country colapsed,the products your coutry sells are selling at a very low price.Your country doesnt produce any oil and the price of oil has skyrocketed,your country cant pay the interests on it`s debt and it defaults on it. Inflation soars and you loose your job!!! You decide you have to go to the U S to work and send your family some money to survive,you are still in your country. You go to the U S embassy to find out what you have to do to go to the U S legally. Now everyone,tell me what do you think the embassy would tell you? Be honest,let`s see what you think you would be told.
Posts: 66 | Registered: Jan 2005
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Woo Sasha! Easy there, killer. Don't start slapping people with your flip-flops! Unless they like it...
Honestly sanlucas, I can only form a vague idea of what the US embassy would say. The biggest resource of south american countries (and many 3rd-world nations) is said to be unskilled labor. Assuming I was in this group, I believe the people at the embassy would tell me one of two things:
1. They'd probably tell me too bad, go home. I'd have nothing unique to differentiate me from the masses of others seeking entry.
OR
2. If I was processed for citizenship, it'd most likely be a slow, drawn-out process. Government is sluggish here, and for proof all one needs to do is go stand in line at the post office or their local DMV.
Since I'm not in that situation, I don't know how I'd go about solving the problem.
Posts: 228 | Registered: Feb 2004
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Answer yourselves one question.Why do Mexicans come here illegally?? Why is there not a system set up for Mexicans to become citizens just like any other person coming from other parts of the world...My husbands family came from Mexico in the 40's,became American citizens within 5 yrs with no problem..
Assignment....what is so different in 2005 then it was in the 40's..your answer is why Mexican people come here illegally..ya gotta dig deep to get the "real" answer
Hint#1The corruption does'nt only lie within the Mexican Goverment..Although ,Mexico is one of the most corrupt places I've been too... bottom line:There a marriage made in heaven somewhere here. Read between the lines..........
Hint #2 FICA, SOCIAL SECURITY and MEDICARE(who's pocket do all un-filed income tax returns go into...Hmmmmmmm....Mexico....NO.....
The # thing that I think SUCKS!! For the Actual American citizen is...The cost of health care that we pay(what my hubby and I pay for health care is insane, and thats getting it from my employer)...while an illegal can have a baby at the county hospital for only $50.00.This effects all of us! This is one of the main contributing factors to the rising cost of health care in the US.
Something does have to be done about the illegal imagration in the US...
posted
If you have no skills you cant come into the country legally. After the engineers design a product somebody has to put it together(unskilled workers) I strongly believe that if they could come into the country legally they would go back after a few years without bringing their families here. From 1948 until 1969 28 million mexicans came into the country legally,24 million went back to Mexico.If they could go back and forth legally to visit their families those families would stay there,it`s cheaper to raise a family there. There is no visas for unskilled workers,they just dont exist. If their families dont have to come here their children wont go to school here nor will they go the the emergency room. Those workers would pay taxes. As for the ones who are already here: If they have been here for 5 yrs or more I would give them a work permit renewable every year for 10 yrs.After that if they paid their taxes and stayed out of trouble I would give them a green card. As punishment for breaking the law I would fine them $1000 per year for those ten years. They would receive $2000 credit to be used for tuition for english classes. After 5 yrs of holding a green card I would tell them they have to become U S citizens or face deportation. P S Sasha I want to suck your toes so bad!!! That is all LOL
Posts: 66 | Registered: Jan 2005
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whilst they are illigal they dont have rights because they dont officially exist, so I think we should take advantage of this because its cheap labour and there not much space because its 40 to a house anyway so to keep all the immigrents. without them we would have no ice crea men, no corner shops or anything.
-------------------- "And kings shall be thy nursing fathers, and their queens thy nursing mothers: they shall bow down to thee with their face toward the earth, and lick up the dust of thy feet . . ." —Isaiah 49:23 Posts: 115 | Registered: Jun 2004
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quote:Originally posted by mystik: [QB] We dont take jobs, we just do the jobs the majority is too lazy to do or think theyre too good for.
What an insulting remark. That is just a liberal-douche rationalization used to excuse millions of freeloaders. It's even used by conservative rich land-owners who want to improve their bottom-line in developments being sold for the highest market value. An untrue statement, and ignorant, at BEST. OMG, I am a 4th generation painter/paperhanger, and am constantly losing work to illegal immigrants. They will work for 10 hrs. a day, at $10.00/hr., tax free, and send most of that back to Mexico. I now have to find a new career. Once upon a time, a US CITIZEN could have a trade such as this, and actually support his family. I know and love many mexicans, most of which are here illegally, and don't blame them at all. If the roles were reversed, I would do the same.
But what if, (and this is a HUGE "what if",) the US dollar somehow shrank to be less than that of the peso, (I DID say it was a huge "what if",) and Americans started going to mexico to work in sweatshops, host cockfights, process chicken, build pretty much everything, etc., and lowered the rate of pay for labor to the point where most non-liscensed tradesmen and women had to get out of industries they had spent most of their lives mastering and receiving good pay for, and all of a sudden had to go find new careers because thier politicians and elite rich were making more money off of illegal labor than having to pay competent tradesmen, and women(!)and were too busy being greedy to do anything about enforcing immigration laws. You would not like it, not one little bit. The very concept of having a "country", and being a citizen of said country, is to be able to prosper and live your life as far as your government does it's JOB to see that become a reality. If Mexico doesn't have it's shit together enough to increase GDP, and make Mexico a better place to live, then that's too bad. Apply for citizenship, and do it right or don't come at all. If y'all didn't flood the border every damn day, there would be better chances of actually getting citizenship here. Now, since the illegal immigrants use our roads, trains, water, etc, and do not for the most part pay any taxes, the rest who do end up suporting that. If you do not belive me, try slicing your finger, going to the emergency room, and waiting amongst 60 illegals with bellyaches loking for free healthcare, and then getting charged $1500.00 for 10 stitches. There are enough freeloaders who ARE citizens, dogging the system to death without 150 million more from Mexico showing up to do the same. There is no question in my mind, if I could send them all back, I would. In fact, I would love to see a national sales tax, so that at least we could recoup some of their earnings in the form of taxes. The US gives out $100 BILLION in aid every year, the most of ANY country in the world, and AS IF that isn't enough, there is always someone crying "foul", and asking for MORE... How much can the US be held responsible for?!? It's time for the governments of the world to step the fuck up and actuall do their own countries some good!!! I would send illegals back to all their countries, and build a 1/4 mile high wall around the US. It worked in Troy for 600 years.
-------------------- I know when I'm licked... all over. Posts: 401 | Registered: Jun 2004
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BTW, Lou, you are dead on the money. It's is ALWAYS about the money!!! and mystik, read Che Gueverra, and get back to me. If conditions in Mexico are so bad, and corrupt, then a revolution is way overdue. Read up on the French Revolution, while you're at it... I would love to see heads roll down my street. The gap is widening between rich and poor, and every one of us, legal or illegal are getting the shaft. My last post was to show how angry I am at MY OWN GOVERNMENT for not doing it's job right, not a diss on the illegals. Power to the peephole!!!
-------------------- I know when I'm licked... all over. Posts: 401 | Registered: Jun 2004
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quote:Originally posted by mystik: [QB] We dont take jobs, we just do the jobs the majority is too lazy to do or think theyre too good for.
What an insulting remark. That is just a liberal-douche rationalization used to excuse millions of freeloaders. It's even used by conservative rich land-owners who want to improve their bottom-line in developments being sold for the highest market value. An untrue statement, and ignorant, at BEST. OMG, I am a 4th generation painter/paperhanger, and am constantly losing work to illegal immigrants. They will work for 10 hrs. a day, at $10.00/hr., tax free, and send most of that back to Mexico. I now have to find a new career. Once upon a time, a US CITIZEN could have a trade such as this, and actually support his family. I know and love many mexicans, most of which are here illegally, and don't blame them at all. If the roles were reversed, I would do the same.
But what if, (and this is a HUGE "what if",) the US dollar somehow shrank to be less than that of the peso, (I DID say it was a huge "what if",) and Americans started going to mexico to work in sweatshops, host cockfights, process chicken, build pretty much everything, etc., and lowered the rate of pay for labor to the point where most non-liscensed tradesmen and women had to get out of industries they had spent most of their lives mastering and receiving good pay for, and all of a sudden had to go find new careers because thier politicians and elite rich were making more money off of illegal labor than having to pay competent tradesmen, and women(!)and were too busy being greedy to do anything about enforcing immigration laws. You would not like it, not one little bit. The very concept of having a "country", and being a citizen of said country, is to be able to prosper and live your life as far as your government does it's JOB to see that become a reality. If Mexico doesn't have it's shit together enough to increase GDP, and make Mexico a better place to live, then that's too bad. Apply for citizenship, and do it right or don't come at all. If y'all didn't flood the border every damn day, there would be better chances of actually getting citizenship here. Now, since the illegal immigrants use our roads, trains, water, etc, and do not for the most part pay any taxes, the rest who do end up suporting that. If you do not belive me, try slicing your finger, going to the emergency room, and waiting amongst 60 illegals with bellyaches loking for free healthcare, and then getting charged $1500.00 for 10 stitches. There are enough freeloaders who ARE citizens, dogging the system to death without 150 million more from Mexico showing up to do the same. There is no question in my mind, if I could send them all back, I would. In fact, I would love to see a national sales tax, so that at least we could recoup some of their earnings in the form of taxes. The US gives out $100 BILLION in aid every year, the most of ANY country in the world, and AS IF that isn't enough, there is always someone crying "foul", and asking for MORE... How much can the US be held responsible for?!? It's time for the governments of the world to step the fuck up and actuall do their own countries some good!!! I would send illegals back to all their countries, and build a 1/4 mile high wall around the US. It worked in Troy for 600 years.
Well I dont know what to tell ya buddy. Didn't mean to discriminate or insult you or your race, but it's damn true. Much like you believe that not all hispanics are here giving you the shaft, I believe that a lot of whites are too lazy to do these damn jobs. Im not saying you are, but a shit load of them are and you cant deny it. America has gotten lazier, and illegal immigrants have capitalized on that. Don't get me wrong, I don't think that we should open the border up and let everybody come in, they SHOULD crack down on how many come in. My problem is that when people try and put up an argument about illegal immigrants taking Americans jobs, its irritating when I know damn well these people would rather be sitting on their ass watching TV than working. Most of the people on welfare are white. Another line that is irritating: "150 million more from Mexico" For one, there is hardly that many Mexicans here, and again is a stereotype. That all illegals are from Mexico. It's hard on both sides though...there are a lot of hard working people over there who want to come here and make money. And they do, wether it be working in a supermarket, cutting grass, contracting or whatever. At the same time, America, for the sake of money, is taking advantage of the fact that people from other countries are willing to work more for less money. Don't blame the supply, blame the demand. Why doesnt the US do something to companies like Dell, Microsoft, Compaq, Sony, etc? Instead of keeping the customer service jobs here in the US that would provide millions of Americans with jobs, they send em to the middle east, so that people there will do them for a fraction of the price. I don't know. There's so much shit going on that it's hard to deal with it all. Didn't mean to offend, there's is just a lot of lazy whites out there that need someone to blame. Why not blame the hispanics and blacks? If you're hard working like you and Lou seem to be, then I wish you the best and I do believe its not fair to you. But that can't be said for a lot of the American population who do a mediocre job and expect excellent pay. I'm done for now.
Posts: 779 | Registered: Dec 2003
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Mystik, I got the 150 mil figure from the Census Bureau, I'm not making it up. Also, you're only half-right. Yes, there are lazy assholes here, who stay on welfare, et all. Yes, they complain about the illegals taking our jobs. ("took 'er jobs!") I still don't think it's fair to a taxpaying citizen to have to suck all of this shit up. Have you been to the emergency room lately? My GOD! I went in for stitches and there were AT LEAST 80 mexicans there... OK, maybe a couple were Ecuadorean, or from Chile, but seriously. All of them waiting for free medical help. And getting it.
I saw the bill for my ten stitches, and it was $1064.00 My copay: $100.00
Now why would ten 1/2" long pieces of nylon, 25cc of lidocain, and an hour of someone's time cost that much? Gee, I don't know, maybe... Cost deferrment? On to ME?!? Fuck that shit. There is not legitimate benefit to having millions of illegals here, I'm sorry. Oh, BTW, not all illegals are hispanic? yeah, I see a ton of Canadians here illegally working for $8.00/hr. Also, there is a growing number of Inuit coming down the West coast looking for jobs in the fish markets... PA-LEASE... If you actually read my ramblings, you'd see that I wasn't BLAMING anyone but the wealthy fucks making cheese off of them. I was actually compassionate for once, and you go off and try to reiterate your Wack-ass point. Problem is, I DON'T CARE about Mexico's economy, or it's corrupt-ass govt., or it's refugees. Let the people come up and fix the shit. Fuck Mexico. Fuck the bougois bog-trotters. Mystik, get your head out of your ass. You are NOT downtrodden, and have it WAY nicer than any of your ancestors did, so can it. Stop trying to champion a causeless cause. Nobody cares about how shitty Mexico is, or it's inhabitants. You get no pity from me. Your post rants on and on about w"whites" blaming others, and in it you do nothing but blame "whites", and throw you useless stereotypes around AS IF this somehow justifies what you are: A racist. Blow me. This is my last word on this topic, and I am unanimous in this.
-------------------- I know when I'm licked... all over. Posts: 401 | Registered: Jun 2004
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LOL. So angry. That's what seperates an understanding person like Lou, from a person like you. (Hey that rhymed!) I didn't ask for sympathy, nor did my country, especially not from you. I wasn't trying to attack you, or whatever background you came from, I'm just stating my side of the story. I'm looking out for my skin, and my back. If that means you pay 1000 dollars for 9 stitches, then so be it. I dont care. You want to try and do something about it? Go right ahead. You cant. You wont. You'll just sit there and complain to your friends about it. No need to be so hostile towards me, I didn't kill your father. You have deeper problems than worrying about illegal immigrants taking your jobs. How bout gettin some education? I am. You think an illegal immigrant can take a job at an Architecture firm from me? lol. A racist? I never called you a racist, so why the attack on me? Judging from those horribly put together sentences you've got going, you are nothing but a disgruntled white guy, mad at the system because you can't seem to make ends meet. And that's fine by me. I'm sorry to any (with the exception of this guy) if I offended your race or whatever you believe in, I'm just stating my opinion. Can't please everyone, and there are sure to be some disgruntled people along the way. Same with affirmative action. I deal with racism a lot more than you do man, so just relax and go tell yourself how right you are. I'm going to go back to my racist ways, with my racist food, and and type on this racist computer and drink my racist coke. ::chuckle::. Sad to say, but you sir are the racist. You are the hostile one. You are the angry one...not me. Sorry to the rest of the forum for this rambling, I'm done with you anyway. Try and enjoy your life. I do.
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